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calculating total client data protected

decsnz

Hi,

  Is there a way of calculating the total undepduped data protected for a client. This would include any changed data over the retention period. Avamar only seems to be able to report data after dedeplication and what the last backup size was. I am interested in reporting actual total data protected.

  • 1. Re: calculating total client data protected
    Sean Xu

    Hi,

     

    There is the report function which could meet your request.

     

    Open Avamar Administrator Console,

    Tools --> Manage Reports...

    select 'Activities - Bytes Protected Client' or 'Activities - Bytes Protected Client - 2'

    'Run'

    'Retrieve'

     

    You could see the report of total protected data by client. also could export the report if needed.

     

    Hope the above information would be helpful.

  • 2. Re: calculating total client data protected
    decsnz

    Hi, Yes I looked at that, but it only give the last backup and the bytes new. Which I beleive is after deduplication. I need to get bytes new before deduplication. I am trying to calculate the total amount of data protected. Which would mean calculating the last backup and adding the daily change to that over the retention period.

     

    Here's a question for everyone. How does everyone else charge for Avamar backup. We are looking to offer this as a service to our customers.

     

    Cheers

  • 3. Re: calculating total client data protected
    JasonBailey

    there is a field in the v_actitivies_2 table on the mcdb of the utility node called "bytes scanned" for any backup job which sounds like what you want

     

    in the avamar admin guide it describes how to setup ODBC postgres driver so you can query the MCDB directly via excel or whatever, it is very useful

     

    the way I have done Avamar billing for MSPs is to use DPA which collects this field as "size scanned" which I rename to "size protected". There is a report which leverages a DPA source called "total size scanned MB" and it will total up protected data per client per day.

     

    a lot of customers ask about billing on deduped data rather than protected data, however this usually turns out to be a flawed concept when you think it through

  • 4. Re: calculating total client data protected
    joka

    I'm also working on a billing system for Avamar backups and we want to bill the total amount of data the client stores on the storage for Avamar.

     

    I haven't figured out yet how to sum that up.

     

    Johannes

  • 5. Re: calculating total client data protected
    JasonBailey

    Johannes

     

    Its pretty much impossible, currently.

  • 6. Re: calculating total client data protected
    chrisvemc

    DPA offers chargeback.

    Maybe you could purchase DPA with the appropriate number of AVAMAR licenses for it and then utilize chargeback together with all of DPA's wonderful features.

  • 7. Re: calculating total client data protected
    JasonBailey

    DPA can't do chargeback on the amount of data stored on Avamar for a single client, as this is not recorded in Avamar itself.

     

    DPA can do chargeback on "size protected" though

  • 8. Re: calculating total client data protected
    Sean Xu

    Actually 'Bytes Protected' means the logical data backed up before dedup. That does not mean the physical bytes stored on Avamar server.

  • 9. Re: calculating total client data protected
    DSM

    Same issue here...

    DPA does not provide information regarding the total undedupped information and even if latest version 5.7 gives information about retention it still does not give the total space occupied by a client (including shared hash/chunk/atomic hash etc...)

     

    I dont understand why a SQL query could not give this information as all informations are linked together at a point or another otherwise we should not even be able to restore data from a backup.

  • 10. Re: calculating total client data protected
    aj2546

    I have wondered the same thing also, although my issue was if I delete a backup how much space can I get back. The answer is it depends on what other clients are sharing the same data, and support was unable to answer that.

     

    Avamar is great, but it is a mystery in a box, unless you have access to internal documents. I am surprised there isn't a conspiracy theory involving how Avamar was developed from alien technology. Just joking, Avamar is superb (if sized properly).

  • 11. Re: calculating total client data protected
    JasonBailey

    DSM wrote:

     

    Same issue here...

    DPA does not provide information regarding the total undedupped information and even if latest version 5.7 gives information about retention it still does not give the total space occupied by a client (including shared hash/chunk/atomic hash etc...)

     

    I dont understand why a SQL query could not give this information as all informations are linked together at a point or another otherwise we should not even be able to restore data from a backup.

     

    This is not a DPA limitation, this is an Avamar limitation that DPA inherits. Avamar does not track the post dedupe client size, so there is no way for DPA to pull it out via SQL. The Avamar postgres DB is open for you to run SQL statements, you can even run psql on the utility node to see for yourself.

     

    I think initially most people think that chargeback/billing on post dedupe client size is the best way to go, however there is a number of awkward situations which could occur from this.

     

    e.g. customer1 with 30 clients gets deduped client size of 5.0TB @ 50%, new customer2 is added with 50 clients and gets 0.5TB @ 95% deduped size. customer1 then moves to another grid or another backup product, then customer2s size goes from 0.5 to 5.0 TB overnight. This could be hard to explain...

     

    Really the only "fair" way is to bill on protected client size, the dedupe savings to goto the service provider and reflected in the end price.

     

    edit: P.S. to answer your last question, there probably isn't any technical reason why Avamar can't be enhanced to track this, I think they are working on it

  • 12. Re: calculating total client data protected
    DSM

    Hi Jason,

     

    thanks for the answer but it still does not satisfy me in terms of alien technology.

     

    One will agree that data of customer are stored in data stripe which are composed of are composed of atomics stripe (main componenent), fault tolerance part, composte stripe and accounts stripe.

    All those informations are stored in the db.

    When a restore occurs the backup root check the root hash that is linked to the composites hashes which are linked to the atomic hashes and subsequently are linked to the atomics chunks that composes the data.

    In term of db there is no reason why we could not get a request that checks all atomics chunks accessible by one domain or one client.

     

    I'm going to check with psql what i can get from the db

     

    Also in your example, this supposes that we can't get the undedupped information and that we would charge only the tranfered data which is of course absurd.

    Final point charging for protected data when retention policy is the same for everyone is easy but it become impossible to get a correct number when retention is dfferent because we have no idea how much data is really stored by a client.

     

    In fact the best way might be to charge in term of Restorable data adapted to the retention period (the longer the cheapest). This is a value we can get very easily. The only part which is difficult is to explain this policy to the customer.

  • 13. Re: calculating total client data protected
    JasonBailey

    The postgres db info is in the system admin guide, appendix c. It explains what all the fields are.

     

    Also in the same pdf do a search on ODBC and you will find the database login info.

     

    However...the MCDB does not contain info to the granuality you desire, such as stripe based info. The stripe info is stored in the GSAN which is the application itself.

  • 14. Re: calculating total client data protected
    DSM

    If everything is stored in the application itself then yes, there is in this case nothing we do to do into the backup detail in terms of chunk :-/

    Too bad

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